Every week on Monday morning , the Council and invited guests weigh in at the Watcher’s Forum, short takes on a major issue of the day. This week’s question: Generally speaking, do you think the relationship between the sexes has changed for better or worse in the last 30 years? Why?
The Independent Sentinel: I’m answering as a woman and I’m answering on a personal level. Overall I’m not happy with the changes in women and can’t speak to how men feel about them.
birth. They think they sound cool cursing. A lot of women seem to have
lost the modesty and self-regard that kept them from indiscriminate bed
hopping and dressing like women if the night. I don’t appreciate men who
live their lives like that either by the way.
represents a moral disintegration of society and it sets a terrible
example for the youth.
made me strive harder.
less of a priority for some, at least it does here in NY.
more of a problem than in the past and parents are neglecting their children more than ever. They often compensate by spoiling them or blaming others, like teachers, for their children’s problems.
generosity. and I want to see them make more of a mark in our relationships period.
tone. That needs to swing back a bit and they do negatively influence societal values and relationships. They are propagandists.
the way it’s going and I think it will hurt us in the long run.
are, sadly, outdated. A true gentleman sees that role as an honorable
thing to do. Hold the door for a lady, give up your seat – even if it is
on a lifeboat. We evolved over thousands of years where males were
taught to protect females. Now women are more likely to be offended by
this behavior. Younger males have grown up with “liberated” females. It
is nothing to have a female call a guy for a date, and even pay –
although most ladies are willing to overlook women’s liberation when the
excited to see her face no barriers to her life’s dreams because she is a
female. But part of me is sad because the same freedom I celebrate for
her carries with it greater difficulties and responsibilities. Strangers
won’t hold doors or give up their seat for her and these same strangers
are far more willing to let her fend for herself and not make her path a
care to report), there was a serious improvement in women’s status. I do
see a real empowerment of women, almost full removal of the glass
ceiling and other barriers that prevent career, family and other kinds
of equality. Saying this, of course there are still pockets of male
chauvinism here and there, but time does its thing, and I think the
overall trend is positive. As far as I am concerned, I don’t feel that
my daughter’s career and life in general suffered from any “special
treatment” that was missing in my son’s. What better litmus test can one
apply?Saying this, there are a few sources of potential and/or growing trouble:
sects: Islamists mostly, of course, but Judaism and Christianity in
their ultra-orthodox “implementations” do degrade women and women’s
status. One can see the Judaic part in some places in Israel and the
Christian “contribution” especially in what used to be Soviet Union and
its East-European satellites, where the Church’s rise was extremely fast
and caused a lot of turbulence.
- Militant feminism. I don’t have to tell Americans what it is, only
that, in my opinion, this “movement” is far from being done in.
Unfortunately, like many other revolutionary movements, feminism, once
it (mostly) accomplished its goals, started to stagnate and to look for
ways to reinvent itself, as any organization with a strong instinct of
self-preservation. As a result, feminism produced that militant offshoot
that has taken the initially valid ideas and goals to absurdity and
continues to generate ill will and ridicule itself. In effect it causes
more damage to feminism than male chauvinists could have ever dreamed
about. But, since most of these distinguished ladies reside in US, it’s
mainly your problem.
- Political Correctness. Being a thin layer of veneer on our uncouth
souls, it hides more than it changes. Just like militant feminism, PC
tends to cause the opposite of what it supposedly aims to achieve. For
instance, like that Austrian law about the blonde jokes.
The Noisy Room: I would say the relationship between the sexes has changed for the worse over the last 30 years. We have been subjected to massive social engineering. Socialists, operating through psychologists, have gone to great lengths to blur the lines between gender roles and burdened families with taxation to the point where the nuclear family has fractured by the necessities of income. Single breadwinner homes are increasingly rare and home raised children are rarer still.
Men have been “feminized,” women have been “aggressivized” and children, in the process of being “socialized,” are increasingly,aggressively self important, self centered and self serving. As a socially engineered society produces successive generations of amoralized young adults, and “belonging” no longer includes the family, the natural relationship between men and women corrodes in favor of adversarial relationships. Even married couples compete for
space and dominion within the home. Children are no longer offspring and progeny, so much as they are products of Mommy and Daddy’s success to be showcased to Mommy and Daddy’s peers or alternatively, a continuing bundle of self entitlement burden.
The engineered framework imposed on families through public schooling, non-stop advertising memes of ‘women are smart, men are dumb,’ ‘kids are smart, adults are dumb’ and ‘politically correct grouping are smart, middle class, white dudes are dumb,’ no longer supports something as quaint as a nuclear family unit having parents that provide discipline, guidance and leadership rather than money, attention and privilege.
The natural relationship of women and men, now overstressed by these artificially imposed tensions and competing priorities, continues to unravel. Men and women each had defined, unique roles in the relationship before and after marriage. Those roles have been blurred, distorted and shredded to the point that a solidified relationship and a family are increasingly difficult to define and characterize. Without morality, a grounded religious belief and a core work ethic, the family unit and the relationship between a man and a woman can only exist in a warped, corrupted form. That is what the last 30 years of Progressive secularism has brought us.
same expectations that men have to be successful in a career. Instead of having
the choice to stay at home with their children, many women are forced by
economic necessity to return to work soon after bearing a child.
achieved the opposite result. Thank you Betty Friedan and Gloria Steinem!
women is the sole fault of just one sex, or just one societal factor; but I believe a big part of it is due to a lack of respect for people in general that has only increased over the years. We live in a very licentious and in-your-face culture which demands instant gratification (just look at the profits of the porn industry if you disagree). Additionally, we also find ourselves in a culture where the New Marxists of the Left purposefully try and destroy the whole concept of traditional family, and to blur the lines between the sexes–an androgynous culture being the stated goal (i.e. sameness).
When I was coming of age, sex, drugs and rock & roll was the mantra of the day; it’s even more over-the-top for young people in our society now. Yet I’ve have witnessed death, jail, insanity, divorce and the utter heartache of many who have chosen the dissipated path of the self-indulgent and morally bankrupt lifestyle–me being one of them back in the day. A culture where everybody is running around boffing each other and indulging in every capricious whim is not a good thing. I have yet to see any good come from it, yet we’re fed a steady diet of it on a daily basis from many quarters. Bottomline: if you don’t have any self-respect, you’re sure as hell not going to have any respect for the opposite sex, or anyone else, for that matter. That’s a no-brainer if you ask me.
notice can be summarized in the apparently trite statement:men and women are different.Each group expects something different from the
interaction.Things are worse when we
expect men and women to have the same reactions to similar circumstances, and
try to adjust their behavior to fit certain social expectations.
more than just raise children, but acknowledge that many women (and some men)
are content to stay home and work as housewives and mothers.And treat each individual with dignity.
itself a theoretical construction.That
notion assumed that society created sexual difference, yet recent studies in
neuroscience, psychology, ethnography and genetics have, as Harvard Psychology
Professor Steven Pinker observed, indicated that sex differences that almost certainly originate in human biology.”Those who respect that difference will certainly see an improvement in their relationships with the other sex and those who do not will see them deteriorate.
As the French often say,“Vive la difference!”
The Glittering Eye: That’s a difficult question, so difficult that I don’t think I can answer it. So I’ll answer a slightly different question:
the changes of the relationship between the sexes over the last fifty
years in the United States been good or bad for most people?”
parts. The legislative and enforcement changes, e.g. equal pay for
equal work,banning of sexual harassment in the workplace,
have been good. However, I think the empirical evidence strongly
suggests that wemust conclude that the social changes have not been good for most people.
education today, look no farther. Not to race or poverty or teachers unions
or bad teachers or bad schools. Look to the changes in the
relationship between the sexes. The physiological and neurological effects of stress on children means that they come to school unprepared to learn. For the kind of love and stability that kids need to thrive, they need two parents in a committed, stable relationship.
Yes, it has changed and the change has been for the worse. What we’re
seeing now is a profound lack of respect between the sexes. (I’m
talking generally, of course, rather than specifically.) Three decades
of radical feminism have left women viewing men as an enemy determined
to subjugate and rape them. Men, unsurprisingly, view women as hostile
and dangerous viragoes who, merely by whispering the words “rape” or
“harassment,” can destroy them. Thirty years of sexual liberation have
also seen men and women (again, en masse) view each other as objects for
transitory sexual gratification.One could say that the lack of respect and the objectification of
the opposite sex has always characterized men’s attitude towards women.
In the pre-liberation era, women were “silly little things,” who
existed to have children, clean the house, and gratify men’s sexual
needs. But American popular culture was never that crude. Regardless
of individual attitudes, popular culture enshrined women as people
worthy of respect precisely because they did give birth to and raise the
next generation, and because they did support the man at home and in
Many women are filling the same roles nowadays as they did in the
pre-liberation era (raising kids, being homemakers, etc.), but that role
is denigrated. In other words, while women are now earning as much as
men for comparable work, have open to them employment pathways no one
could have imagined forty or fifty years ago, and get to bed as many
partners as their male counterparts, the price they’ve paid for that
freedom has been the destruction of a mutually respectful culture
between the sexes.
Maggie’s Notebook :It’s my opinion that the relationship between the sexes has changed for the better, but not due to any significant
influence coming from the “feminist” movement. Female college students
have steadily outpaced male applicants for years. Higher levels of
education have opened doors and minds. Since the 70′s, women have
learned that they can support themselves, and their children if they
must. It has been a long rocky road for women to receive equitable
support for their children from a former spouse. On the other side, it
was a long rocky road for a man to gain access to his children once he
was out of the house. Today we see mothers and fathers living in
separate households but both interacting with their children, supporting
each other and sharing responsibility. Fathers are closer to their
kids. It’s a very good thing not to be faced with raising children
alone. Two thumbs up to parents who act like adults.
the “glass ceiling” is still said to loom, there is no doubt women have
risen to professional levels that were only a dream in the 60′s and
before. Today, with the knowledge that you can work or not, there has
been a turn-around. More women want to be home with their children in
the formative years, and some Dads want to be stay-at-home Fathers.
Women have had the work “experience,” or know that they can have it, if
they want it. There is no need to feel defensive about either choice,
unless you want to listen to, and be influenced by, Liberal women who
view Mother’s not working outside the home as having no worth. Do we
care what they think? No we don’t.
long been the purview of men, but no longer. Today women are as
involved in government as men, whether through public office or simply
blogging their hearts out. With technology, women can stay at home and
work or not, and understand the world on the same level as a corporate
executive. We can have it all, but more importantly, we can have what we
man of the family has, to know each and every day that he must get up
and support his family. Those who do, or who try with their entire
being, are too be praised – because the same is not expected of women.
Full disclosure: I was never faced with raising my family by myself and I
am grateful for it. My husband has always shared responsibility equally
with me. The days of ignoring the mind of the “little woman” are gone. I
am blessed beyond measure, but God knew what he was doing when he
didn’t plop me down in a covered wagon on a prairie somewhere to pioneer
a new land. I would have failed miserably. In those days we had ‘real’
women, and real ‘men’ who fought everyday to survive. What could
possibly have been more difficult?
I believe that the new focus on flattening the differences between the sexes comes with a large price. It requires both men and women to fight their natural instincts, their feelings and intuitions, and sets up false narratives for both sexes to interact and live within. In many ways it makes life a lot harder. Women are no longer expected to be the ‘keepers’ of the house but in reality they are in most families. And although men generally are open to encouraging and supporting the successes enjoyed by the women they share their lives with, some find it hard to celebrate a woman’s triumphs that exceed their own because they feel it diminishes them, which then in turn ultimately undermines the relationship(s). It now puts partners in competition at almost every level.
We are all instinctively animals and the rules of society and religion were the balance. The women’s lib movement promoted by Progressives and the Bill Clinton/Monika Lewinsky affair, in addition to the drug culture, changed the sexual landscape in America and was the beginning of the breakdown of the family and traditional values.
There are no longer clear rules and choices, which in many ways makes modern relationships more difficult and in other ways actually limits choices. Women and families who choose to have the wife and mother stay at home and be homemakers, stay at home mothers, and more traditional wives are often diminished by their more modern and hip counterparts. And conservatives who believe in waiting to have sex until marriage, traditional marriage and make pro-life choices with God at the center of their relationships are coming under increasing fire even though those choices generally produce stronger families, more enduring marriages and in the long run a stronger country.
In the end the changes in the relationship between the sexes has weakened those relationships for most, because the two parties are always in competition instead of working together for common goals and with the weakening of enduring relationships and marriages comes the weakening of families which are the backbone of society; weakening America herself.
Well, there you have it.
Make sure to tune in every
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Council has its weekly contest with the members nominating two posts
each, one written by themselves and one written by someone from
outside the group for consideration by the whole Council. The votes
are cast by the Council, and the results are posted on Friday morning.It’s a weekly magazine of some of the best stuff written in the blogosphere, and you won’t want to miss it.